So if I bring a person in I get 10% of their purchases, but if they bring someone else in then I get nothing of what that is? Seems like a even worse pyramid then the typical.

This is actually a brilliant idea. It encourages width in expansion, which is key to keeping the expansion going. If someone only develops a few legs, then they could reasonably just sit back and collect money without doing anything after a certain point. That does nothing for Decipher and certainly does not promote the game.

Focusing on width and not depth is what keeps the game moving forward. We’ve already seen what the depth of the distributor model has done to prices and expansion of games, with razor-thin margins and sometimes inability to even get product through the channel.

Caias Ward

Yeah, I think the width idea is probably better in the long run, even though it might look bad right at first. Paragon explained things well.

Pyramid structure aside, it severely cuts into the involvement of the hobby stores. Sure, the stores can establish their own Mentor handles, but the players are more likely to be the ones recruiting and getting their handles out to new players. With the direct-order sales scheme, it seems like the hobby stores might be the biggest opponents of this game.

Cheers,
-Matt

I think greedy gaming stores will hate this game for that idealism BUT in the same right my local gaming store, the owner is very cool and just does it for fun. So I think if you work close with your local gaming store as a mentor it could very well give the game a boost without hurting their business.

It is true that Hobby/Game stores may see this product as a potential threat, and may also express resentment at their lack of inclusion. Then again, others will not be concerned. They are successful doing what it is they do, and will not be threatened in any way at all.

Hopefully that “threat/no threat” mindset can change to one of “opportunity” when that first store, or group of stores decides to take up the role of connector or Mentor and invites their entire customer base to visit the FightKlub site.

Hobby/Game stores have the opportunity to participate or not, but a successful Fight Klub™ TCG can make for a successful venture for any and all Connectors and or Mentors. It sure does make the “what if” discussions sexy…
;-)

stores will hate this game for the simple reason that they cant move any product. i love my local game store, but they wont even let us run swccg events there because there is no money in it for them. we can all say that this game may be good, but we dont really know, and most stores will not support it because it does not financially benefit them. its gonna be tough running tournaments in peoples basements,

I thing , this idea is to other who you INTRODUCTION to the game must the frend brinig to you and only the mentor can register a new players

To be honest, I don’t know if the 10% is much of a draw personally, anyway. I would far rather sign people up in order to increase the size of the community. This game will be no fun if there is nobody else in my city playing.

The only reason I think that it is important to get the stores involved is that they often play a key role in promoting tournaments, etc.

The 10% is a (nice) bonus for doing what people do anyway; teach people a game that they enjoy and build a community. The people looking to get into it solely for the 10% reward will be disappointed, I think.

And as far as stores hating the game…why can’t stores become Connectors and promote the game themselves? They’ll get 10% from all of the people that are at their store that they told about the game and that are buying it from Decipher. Not bad for a little time investment and working with a local Founding Mentor.

The correct term is multi-leve marketing. Just look at any GPT site.

It’s an interesting idea, but what I also see is people squabbling over the little things, an extra person here or there. The store that just resells Fight Klub product because some people don’t wanna go through the hassle, or that gets mad at people if they don’t use the store’s name instead of some other person there, etc. These all assuming the game got really popular, of course.

How (or why) would a store resell Fight Klub product? The only availability is direct from Decipher. Tack on shipping, and all of a sudden, the store’s selling it for a loss (unless they charge the shipping, too). What about tax?

In other words, where’s the hassle for people? It’s WAY easier for me to sit at home and pick up my Kilo by going to the website and getting one that driving out to my FLGS and picking one up.

Yeah, i think the 10% is a nice benefit of doing what we like to do. The stores will probably have the most heartache with the online method but I really do think it is a great way for Decipher to go and to keep them in touch with their players. It is the Dell model (before they got into retail) and worked quite well for years. Bit different with this type of product but it’s a great idea and I’m looking forward to seeing how it works for them.

The program itself sounds skeptical at first, however, once you start to think about it this is more of a marketing ploy, in the best sense of the word, than a scheme. think about it, a mentor has to buy product directly from the site in order to teach others how to play. after they teach others to play they have incentive to keep getting others into the game. ultimately the mentor will reach a sort of equalibrium with the money they spend to get new players and the money they get as a return on their investment so to speak. basically the mentors are the public face of the game and its marketing system.

Yeah, exactly, that’s the point. And Decipher saves a TON by A) not having to sell wholesale for cheaper to retailers, B) not needing demo kits, everyone’ll be more than willing to give their own demos, C) not needing to really do any marketing. Hopefully, this extra money can then be reinvested in the game to make it something really cool…hopefully. It remains to be seen.

I agree with Whispering Tree. I think the key will be to use the 10% to create equilibrium as soon as possible.

This is a bit of a repost from another thread, but it fits this conversation:
Here is my plan for dealing with Kilos, the $30 buy in and the 10% kick back.
Mentor buys Kilo for $30.
Kilo has 10 Rares.
Players pay $3 entry fee for tournament. Each one gets a rare.
Non rare cards are given out as demo decks to recruit new players, and/or as freebees for broke regular players who can’t afford to buy Kilos.
Mentor recruits inner circle to help fund the local player community. Inner circle all sign up under mentor’s name so mentor gets 10%.
Mentor pledges to spend the 10% on more kilos that are used as tournament prizes to continue the cycle in the local community.
Inner circle pledges to buy at least one kilo each per expansion to support the local community and the mentor.
Mentor pledges to run weekly/monthly events that give out the cards purchased with the inner circle’s 10%.
Inner circle recruit friends and encourage them to sign up with Mentor’s handle.
Mentor gets more cash, which buys more cards, which supports the local tournament scene.

There is another thread about being allowed to switch mentors. I think that would be a very nice option to have. Being locked into a single mentor forever would not be cool. If all the local players support a single mentor, and that mentor supports the local tournament scene, you could create a self sustaining player community. That would be awesome.

I have a day job. I don’t need the 10% cash. I’m just going to use it to support the local gaming scene. We use a system like this now locally. Here is how your system works.
1. The inner circle/pillars of local gaming community/core players/guys with real jobs donate foils and promos (like the promos you get at cons) to the mentor/tournament director (that would be me).
2. I give the foils/promos to a local largely unemployed student to then sells them on ebay and gets commission for his effort.
3. Student ebay guy sends the money from the sale to my paypal account. 100% of my paypal account is devoted to the local gaming community.
4. I then survey my local payer base and ask them what sets/packs/cards I should spend the money on.
5. I then use the paypal balance to buy cards online. 100% of the cards/packs/sets I buy are given away as tournament prizes.
6. Local inner circle players pull foils/promos in the packs they got a prizes and donate them to repeat step one.

I don’t need the money, I have day job. However, I do want a healthy, local, active player base that I can play cards with on a regular basis. I’ve been using this system for years now and it works quite well. You can use it to run tournaments for a “dead” game (we have 1-2 Trek 1E tournaments per month) or just to subsidize your favorite game that isn’t backed by some huge company (Upper Deck, Wizards).

They key is to have an inner circle that cares about the game and the community. Without them to support you, it is lonely, frustrating and difficult at times. If you have guys in your inner circle who genuinely love the game and want to support it, they will loyally support the game and you the mentor/tournament director. I have guys that drive 3 hours to attend tournaments. Or guys who fly in once every 3 months and schedule there time in town around local tournaments. Recruit the inner circle first. With them, supporting the game is easy. Without them, it is a lot of work.

No offense but I have trouble trusting anyone who says “I don’t need the money”.

-Brad

The pyramid thing is such a great concept.

It’s just sad that 10% * 0 = 0

I think that stores might get excited about this because there really isn’t an upfront cost to them. I have heard a lot of retailers are reluctant to try something new because of the up front cost of investing in product and then if it doesn’t do well they are either stuck with it or have to put it on clearance.

Here they can sign up to be a Mentor, point players to the website for sales and still be supported through an OP program. Most retailers just want to get players into their store. Players in store usually translates to sales and that’s what a retailer wants. Just to sell stuff, usually not specific stuff.

If gaming stores do get mad, oh well. I can go to a friends’ house and have a tournament or go up to the local college and pay 20 bucks for a room for the day to have a big tournament. I think gaming stores will do good by this if they do what Girard suggested. What’s really awesome is that the amount of shelf-space for this game [anywhere] is going to be quite small. I work at a local hobby store [notice, I said hobby] and I think my owner would be thrilled to get money back from his purchases.

Its called multi level marketing. If anyone has heard of the health craze Monavie, they do things the same way. Decipher is only using a compensation plan for its customers. Making something invite only brings a sense of exclusivity to something. Its how a lot of online social networking sites get their founding members as well. A prime example is iminlikewithyou.com or gmail.com. Do some research and you’ll find out decipher is on the right track using this new marketing structure.

Just to be clear – it’s not a pyramid…or a ponzi scheme,
Pyramid = 10% of my people’s purchases, 5% off their people’s purchases, 3% off their people’s people’s purchases…
Ponzi = Join the club by buying from me $400 worth of stuff you can then sell for $2000…and the actual only way to make money is to get people to join as sellers, no one is a real buyer.

Buying direct from Decipher is the way of the future for game, IMO. The fact they set the price above market rates is the big problem.

Something they can avoid if they avoid licensing fees, and go with generic (yet popular) character types. (Ninja vs Pirate anyone?) ;)

Cheers,
-Matt

IMO here’s what you do. The hobby shops hold tournaments with a tournament fee for 3-5 dollars. The store gets all that money. You would use prize support from Decipher and extra cards you don’t need for prizes. You can’t gamble legally in a hobbyshop wihtout a permit because of minors under (21) so cash prizes are useless. Also unless you have another game you play store credit prizes are uselss because you can’t use it on fight klub product. If you’ve noticed most people getting into this game will be random people anyway not affiliated with another tcg/ccg thats the idea at least. So if you go with this idea the store lets you run tournies there and they make money it’s a win-win situation to both parties… It’s really simple and why wouldn’t a store want free money? Most game stores have nothing going on during the week anyway, so if you did tournies during the week then they also wouldn’t be losing any gaming space!